Accelerating Value
Accelerating Value

Episode · 1 year ago

Online Presence: Go Where Your Customers Already Are


Everything is shifting online out of necessity.

Not only your tactical choices but also the way you think about online presence can affect your profitability.

In this episode, I interview Joe Tran, Chief Marketing Strategist at Brandigy, about how he counsels clients on how value is changing in the marketplace.

What we talked about:

- The need for an online presence strategy

- Getting the ROI right on marketing spend

- Brand and culture perception

- Impact from Apple iOS 14.5 and other data tips

Keep connected with Accelerating Value on Apple Podcasts, Spotify, or our website.

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Today. Every budget approval is an investment deal. If you're a marketer, sales or business leader, you had to promise to deliver value and impact. Writing the wave to get there is hard enough. Finding your way through the storm is even harder. If you're looking for that path forward so that you don't wipe out, you've come to the right place. Let's get into the show. Hi Everybody, my name is marks to's welcome to accelerating value. This is a podcast that is totally dedicated to what it takes to create value, to invest in it, to protect it, to accelerate it, to prove that it exists. So we do this weekly. We have a lot of great guests. I really encourage you to tune in. This week is no exception. We have Joe Tran, who is probably one of the most value oriented marketing strategists that I've met in my career and he does a lot with REV ops. He works more broadly as well, and we're just going to have a conversation for about the next twenty or twenty five minutes about how he sees value, how he sees value, where it's going and the understanding of value how that's kind of changing and morphing and within the marketing profession and specifically how he's working with clients to kind of grapple with a lot of change and a lot of alatility in the marketplace. So, Joe, really awesome to heavy man. Thanks. Thank you very much, mark. It's a pleasure to be here. Thank you for inviting me to your podcast. Sure, you bet so. Let's let's start with how things have changed when you work with clients before covid and Africa, when it comes to the pressure that they're under to create value and how they're going about developing strategies to create that value, you see a contrast. In general, I think what's happening more is like everything else that we see in the market place, everything shifting more online because of the necessity, you know, and this can be anything that you know, from your local mom and pop to you know a lot of you know fortune five hundred. If they don't have enough presence that they're trying to expand more and from that they're trying to figure out what's the profitability, what's really working. So you know the value you is where can we invest our money and it's it more successful within that ecosystem? So yeah, basically is be more presence online and everywhere. So, and how are they thinking about I mean, other than channels and venues and things like that? How are they thinking about all the variables that they don't control at all, like and the impact on value that those have? So it could be covid and all things that covid caused. It could be an economic situation. It could be their competitors and what their competitors are up to. How do they how do you? How do you see all this kind of evolving, not just in terms of like tactical choices, but in terms of the way that the marketers are thinking about all this? Well, everything still comes down to performance...

...and results and different KPIS, for example. Right this whole ecosystem pre equived and after corvid is it's forcing people to really understand the user on the individual side, not just more broadly. So you have to understand what's the needs of the individual before you even talk to them and once you start engaging with them, you want to know you know where are they in the pipeline and what stage they are. So given that just being more awareness, not just as a marketer but overall as a organization, to to the needs of the individual or the organizations, and so and tell me how you're advising your your customers to do that. Hot. So you're really talking about an ICP and ideal customer profile. Right. What what is? What does that look like, because I think that that is kind of an underappreciated aspect of marketing and sales that a lot of times in different companies, between startups, tends to get short shrift. So when you're sitting down talking about that with a with a marketing team or even a sales team or both. Right, what's that? What's that like these days? Well, it's it's really defining who your target market is, and say that very broadly. And so, to be specific, say it comes back to the twenty rule, especially they're in Corbette. You really don't want to be all things to all people. You want to be able to understand who you can benefit the most and go after that. And in proof, within that, now your audience, if you're looking at the different channels, you know you hear, you know things like tick talk and this within the social media platform. Why I should be here, I should be there, I should be here and there, but in reality you should be where your customers are and it's not just following the fat and what you will. You think it is a way the fat is going, but really where your customer is and you know the information how they're gathering to solve their particular problem or what problem they have and try to solve that. So you can listen within the market place. You know there's different tools you can do for social listening to understand what's going on. You can obviously create content to make sure your your message and your solutions can fulfill that objective. You can look at doing a little bit more of a deep search within the customer behaviors and user intent and you can do that using, you know, data that you probably deal to know exists, which is Google and facebook. They have in market data. So it's a for instance, if you're selling a vehicle, a certain type of vehicle, you're selling a cheap and that data is present within facebook and within Google up to a point. Now you know the new privacy rules and laws and changes it's happening, so some of that data may be gone. But in general you want to make sure your messages is hitting the right target audience within the right framework at the right time. How do you feel like that your customers these days are thinking about risk, particularly, like are they helping their customers address their risks? But also risk on marketing spend right. So there's there's Roi Right on marketing spin and there's also the risk of not getting that return right that people are kind of...

...wrestling with right now given the volatility in the market. How do you, how are you kind of seeing them deal with that? I think that's such a wonderful question right there. As far as risk, so it's risk of not doing something and risk of missing the opportunity right. Most of the pine people think about risk as hey, I'm going to spend this money, I'm not going to get anything back, but a lot of people don't think about the risk of opportunity. But but this really is an easy way to solve those problems is jump in their fast and jump in there with defined KPI that's not too grandure, not too big, but just small enough which you can do a pilot and test and the build upon that society us and then can continue the momentum. And it Pians on different, you know, marketing company, a different organizations on what that may be and what the KPI may be and what what they're willing to do. But essentially, what define your KPI, what you want to establish or what you want to hit, what you can define as a win and try to do that with a small spend and then accelerate from that, if that makes sense. Yeah, no, absolutely. How do you? How do you when you're talking with a client in one of the things that people really care a lot about today is time to value. Right in the faster the time to value. They see that as also mitigating the risk of a bad decision. Right. They're kind of looking for the lines to cross sooner rather than later. Do you feel like that, when you develop strategies for your your customers, that that's a something that you're being I'm sure it's always been a part of your planning, but is it a bigger part? Is it the same as before? How are people thinking about that? To me, it's always been adding more things to the value to game. That was success. So every campaign it and I want to say every industry, and this some commonalities. Right. So the first is, you know, how do you get that visibility to second is, once you get the visibility, that he how did the sack coming to the pipeline. How can you improve the process within the pipeline? So with all with all of that, you want to make sure that you have things in place. For us, we're leveraging multi channel attributions, multi channel as well as contact, so we know where they are in the pipeline, we know what they with a you know what their needs is, we know at what the stage they are, so we can communicate to them more efficiently and by doing that you're not wasting money on things that they don't want and you're not wasting time on the client side or on your side things that's not necessary. So what you can you can be really lasi focus, not just in attracting the client, but also lasi focus once they come into the pipeline too. So one of the things that that we're talking about a lot here is what a lot of marketers would call performance marketing. Right, it's and how do you think about brand marketing these days? Right, I mean bridge again kind of the contrast before Covid, after Covid, during covid. Right, how do you? How do you see that today? But brand is definitely the distinguisher, right. You can always have you performance marketing. What am I getting for my money? You know, that's always somebody. You know that's the key is I'm giving you x amount of dollars. What am I getting? The results on that, and that can happen. You know, whether...'re a decision maker, marketing director, all the way to the CEO, the CEO as the marketing you know, Cmo, Hey, what I'm giving you this kind of money, one am I getting? So the brand aspect, shoot ecosystem should be carried across throughout the whole organization, because the value. Ironically, my company is named Brandig and it's whatever each step the preceived value is. So it doesn't matter if they see you on TV, a newspaper, radio, but it's also with every touch point. Right. So, for instance, Pizza Hut. You know, just a cook at Pieca Hutt do something stupid and post it on facebook or you know, it looks bad for the whole organization. A CEO makes the bad comment, it's bad for the brand, for the whole organization, and they have to be you know now, immediately. So as far as the brand is more about it's not just the brand what you see by, it's also about the culture. So the culture should be there so that you know the people will like you. Basically, people want to do business with people you like and trust, and that's the same thing with brand. You know, one of the things that's been written about quite a bit, and you saw this a lot in say two thousand and nineteen in particular, where there was a lot. There were a lot of marketers who started to say, wow, you know what, we're touching people so much proactively, meaning, you know, direct marketing soclled performance marketing, that it's actually creating negative brand for us. Right, it's sort of we're sort of irritating our prospects and customers because we're touching them so much. When you when you sit, when you're sitting with one of your clients, how do you counsel them to kind of think about that? Right, is there a is there a is or kind of a rule of thumb that you have about the limits of performance marketing? Well, it again, that goes down to the objectives. Well, what you want to do. You know, like if if it's just say, for instance, you're running a supabowl at you probably going to see that at once, two, three times. That's it. But you're spending ten million dollars in that ad plus all the creatives and whatever that's necessary right put. Or you can just do, you know, fifteen to a second to a minute video, and you see it in Youtube all the time. So it's a matter of whether the consumer likes that or not. They have the opportunity to opt out. But ironically, you know, as far as multi channel, multiple multiple way where the consumer can digest how many touch points, that is the not the market is dictating, and this particular case, but the companies are dictating the privacy issues and how much visibility any given advertiser or organization is going to be displayed. For example, apple, I was fourteen point five and I believe it or how Google is also taking away some of the pixels and cookies. So the trackability to know where people are on the state where they are and the pipeline. And say I look something on the mobile phone, then I can see something on my browser, on my computer. That is going away pretty soon. So the market itself is going to dictate that. Well not then the organization, the high tech companies that are going to dig that Dick take that and there's a mini war happening between different companies. Say facebook,... and Google. There's a lot of, you know, tension within that and saying who's right and who's wrong and what's what should be private, who should see much and how much day they should be known, and how much you should know about organization or a company. What do you what do you see? Are you seeing any impact yet from fourteen to five? Absolutely, I'm seeing as far as trackability, what's going to happen? I'm saying impact on campaign wide. I'm not seeing as much per se volume per se. But but we're been planning on this. So we're structuring it so you can see more quality. So some of the direct draft Click and buy me now, stoff or the retargeting seeing something once and that's it. That ecosystem is going to be hood a lot on the e commerce. Understand the attributions and we're at the convotion is on that. It's going to be hurt on that. So you you should have your data in place, you should have your if you're a big enough organization, you should have your day little lake in place and so that you won't be hood as much. But definitely this is just the very beginning of a very difficult time for marketers. And especially online, when you think about alternatives to that data that's going away. What what do you what are you kind of thinking about? Like where do you want to take your clients on this issue? Ironically, you have to go more high tech and you have to be able to be able to understand who comes to your website and who's your audiences on your own site. You can't depend on the facebook. You can depend on Google for that initial discussion that we have for you know, in market data and such like that. So if you have to basically have the content, get the search that comes to into your upsite, if you're online, get the search to come your site, advertise within that, have tools, whether you're be to be OBBC, be able to have your own first party to data to understand who your audience is and be able to market that correctly, whether you can take that hash data and push it out to create your own audience into all these different platforms or not. But definitely that if you don't have that in place, you will, you know, you would see serious decline in your marketing potentials. I I really agree with that. Dude. Are you seeing anything happening with Linkedin? Linkedin, it is I haven't seen it that I don't advertise so much in Linkedin. I advertise within Google, Youtube and facebook. I haven't seen that. But we we literally plot out business process for our be to be clients to push data and feed data from one platform to another. So litterally, if you want to think of it as plumbing, we create it plumbing so that it's even though it's invisible, is connecting from one data set to another data set so that the we can target the right individual at the right time based on the data set. And you feel like you're able to the tew. You will be able to continue to do that as effectively in both be to be and BTC as you have been in the past. EAT bridging...

...out of the data sets that we historically had access to into whatever's coming. Yes, you just have to be able to have access to so that you are with a provider that have for its party data and that you own. You know you can own that data. So you do data matching, you do data I had attributions on that. Excellent. So so, kind of a challenging period for marketers, but both the pressure to create value and the opportunity to create value. You see it as being just as as significant as it always was. I think so, and think is once you get that hoodle of change, what you need to do. What the initial investment, because this nothing is going to be it goes back to a question what should I invest? Am I going to get the return and value? And also that question of how much we should test right. Just have your goals in place and try and set up those things and see what kind of value you can set from that. For instant, for instance, get the initial tools that can get you the first party data and and push that into the system where your customers are and see if you can get that visibility back again if you starting to lose visibility or that in market data from, you know, the Google or from the facebook or even Linkedin, because linkedin you can see a decline. But if you but on the other side, if your customer basis within those ecosystem already, for instance, if you looking for marketing, you directly marketing, directly to a marketing director per se for a software, you still can market within that. You just going to lose some tracking capability of Hey, when they went to your page, did they convert? Some of that may be gone, but you can track that in your form to see, hey, that data, they did fill out that form. It came from this. And if you have your attribution, if you have your voice party data, then you can match that internally within your your site, within your organization, within your data pool, so you know what's working and how you making money or not. Joe, thanks so much. This has been a great conversation. I think a lot of people will have gotten a lot from this because we got into some pretty strong detail. I think that the shifts that you're talking about with data are going to be really, really interesting to follow. You know it, I think you know addition what you were saying, you know, what I see is that people are gradually becoming aware of the fact that they're going to have to come out of Pii, yes, or more out of it, right, have less of it and they'll have more aggregate data, and that aggregate data has its strengths as well. Right. So it's a it's going to be really, really interesting, I think for the next it will be. Yeah, it's going to be an IT comes down to business model. I think you know, different social platform their free platform. So are they going to sow it charging people to attend the revenue and not depend on just that platform. Is still going to be opt in and new class and stuff like that. So it would be interesting. Actually, I do want to ask you one more question. How are you seeing the future on this whole topic? So, and what I really mean by that is, do you see the tightening of data availability continuing to get more challenging for a while, beyond fourteen, tot five or or...

...whatever Google's doing, or do you feel like that we are? We've kind of also hit a plateau here where everybody can kind of catch their breath and get used to a new situation. For there's more change. Yeah, I've I try to follow the leaders within the space and I ab is one of the leaders. It. Just recently read article on that and they're saying it's going to be very much more difficult. Right now, it's going to be state loss in place. You see that in California. It's going to be other states. You see that with the Europe yeah, there you and you see that what Europe. But you thought then you may see that nationally. What happens in the US. So you have to be, you know, really careful in the data and even if you have the data. Then you have to make sure your data is put protected and you don't, you know, you're not liable to your data being leaked on that. So this a lot of privacy issues. On top of the power that you have, you also have the power. You you need to have the protections in place on that too. Awesome. Thank you so much, Joe. I really appreciate it. Guys, I know that you got a lot out of this. There's just there's a pretty rich vein of gold in this conversation, particularly around the availability of data and the changes that are coming. If you have any questions on this, you'll be able to post them underneath the podcast and and I know that Joe would love to answer them. Thank you so much. Sure. Absolutely. Thank you for having me. The sooner you can optimize your marketing spend, the quicker you can start delivering clear, measurable value to Your Business. That's exactly where business GPS from. Proof analytics can help learn more at proof analytics DOT AI. You've been listening to accelerating value, where raw conversations about the journey to business impact help you weather the storm ahead. To make sure you never miss an episode, subscribe to the show in your favorite podcast player. Until next time,.

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